Recovery of PeachShade’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 7:11 AM
Hi I've been playing Dark Templar for a long time now, and recently decided to write a guide for the class. Please take a look and if you have any suggestions, reviews, etc. Please feel free to comment below!
Recovery of Pyros’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 8:25 AM
Nice guide thanks, knew most of the stuff but still a good read. I've been considering taking my DT to Anton raid, get me some sweet invites and stuff, but curious, what would you think is the min setup for a DT to reliably get into raids?
Right now I have 9pc CK, some shitty shadow mstone that I got for 1m, advanced avatars, the cheap cdr title, a smash/congest pet for when congest is good and a reconstruction weap. Honestly my damage is complete garbage, so I'm thinking I should do more of a support build but I'm not entirely sure at what point it becomes worth getting a DT in a grp. Is 6pc Vilmark set effect actually good? The 3pc and 5pc are kinda bad, the individual pieces have decent effects I guess but really only the belt/legs and to an extent chest have good effects, boots is crit which most people should be capped in(although I guess most ppl aren't in raids I do, so that'd be nice) and shoulders are so so. Is the 6pc perma super armor for everyone? I could see that being nice. I still have some ancient boxes and I'm running vilmark for P&P anyway so I could get there pretty fast just curious how good it really is.
Since I often raid right at reset, most ppl in the raids are super geared so I'm not too sure what DTs usually get invited with and what not. Obviously the utility is provided regardless of gear levels via holds+shred+usir, but not sure.
Oh also one tip that I've seen and you didn't mention is how black mirror counts as a wall, so for example if you black mirror egene during his charge he doesn't move instead of going all the way to the wall. Also something about Black mirror shield effect counting as a self hit or something, so you can proc a variety of stuff by just casting it on nothing, not entirely sure how this one works but I've seen it mentionned a few times, just don't have any gear to test it. DS has similar mechanics with her passive generating self hits which procs gracia shield/plate epics stuff.
Recovery of Holypie’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 10:53 AM
Last updated Feb 24, 2017 at 10:53 AM
I'm of the opinion that DT can probably raid naked if you know what you're doing. The inherent utility is just so good, and you don't need any gear to take advantage of it. Your gear should be fine, people are always on the lookout for holders.
In terms of black mirror shenanigans, I use it to proc full plate swap, since it counts as getting hit. It also counts as hitting things, so you can get evolve stacks from mirroring yourself and your team, as well as charging savior energy. Not sure if this works for anything else though. If you have dark gothic you can use corrupt imposter heart for 10s of huge shadow damage on a 60s cooldown but I found this was kind of a pain to use so I never really abused it.
Edit: some feedback on the guide, enchanted sharp fang is actually stronger than liberation, and you should always be using mirror on yourself to proc the +30 shadow damage. This will be the stronger option unless you have more than 456 shadow damage (good luck without dark gothic and an oblivion soul bender).
Also Quadro cassiterium belt is amazing even if you don't manage to get crit cap. With no crit from gear it's possible to hit around 80-90% crit with enchants and emblems alone, so you're not that far off from crit cap. Also, even if you're not capped on crit you should definitely try to have a crit damage mod, since it's a huge amount of damage that's very easy to get (pets etc). Not having crit damage just because you can't hit crit cap is just gimping yourself for no reason.
Oath boots are another strong buyable legendary piece.
There's also a cheap level 50 or so legendary ygdram ring which nobody knows about, basically it shreds 10% def when you get hit by enemy attacks, which is conveniently procced by mirror. I'd highly recommend this for shadow harvest support setting, and it's honestly a damn good DPS ring as well.
I wouldn't bother with core stone, and hardened heart ONLY if you really need the crit. The shadow runestone is much cheaper and you only lose 1 shadow damage.
It's probably prudent to warn people that refined chaos stone necklace will get them trapped in their own mirrors. You can play around it but it's a huge hassle. Shadow hiding will also get you out.
Infinite vestiges is actually not horrible, it's better than most of the non pars epic subs and is a viable option if you already have savior and full five senses…
I'd also rate elemental dropper, tactical and centurion hero much much much higher, all three deserve to be in tier 1. Elemental dropper is deceptively powerful with the defense shred, and you barely scrape shred cap in Luke raid with this + harvest. It provides strong team utility and very good DPS. A similar argument can be made for tactical, helps your team immensely and it's also quite good for damage. The argument for centurion hero is a bit more subtle, but the skill damage ranges buff your sader by a huge amount. In terms of party play this is the best unupgraded set, even just for solo dps because of how incredibly good it is to give +2 DI +2 apoc and +2 wisdom blessing to your sader. Along with sign of protection, etc. This is an incredibly underrated set.
Also, every % damage modifier other than skill damage suffers from diminishing returns but this should be calculated on a case by case basis with direct comparisons between two pieces for a given environment. Maybe a bit too in depth for this guide but you mentioned it for elenore so decided to bring it up.
For holding taiorik I actually use the strategy of 2x sliding slash then scaffold. It'll track his y axis movement and grab before he starts his iframe suction, then you can chain into binding and cape. The main advantage of this is that you don't need souls, so if your team starts with the right hand room you don't need to waste mirror to get souls for madness. One thing to note is that you NEED to use a sparkling toy before you use cape, because he has a full screen stun which will interrupt your cape and cause you to be sad.
I've also never had shadow harvest cause sliding bug at zombies, usually it's just when there's a soul bender with fear of darkness which slows, face down shoes, or lag. Show and lag are the main culprits in my experience.
If you're doing fourth hatchery without a sader, mirror your party before you go in to floo's room. The 50% damage reduction shield is a godsend and will prevent you from getting one shorted.
One last thing, for mertadorock in volcano, DO NOT rely on shadow binding! This will not hold him! Wait for him to turn solid and immediately use scaffold, this prevents the search light from spawning. Follow this up with punishment if he isn't dead by the time scaffold is over. If he's not dead by the time punishment is over, get new dealers.
Okay finally done. Overall an excellent guide, just some small (or not) things that are honestly really obscure and irrelevant most of the time. Great job, maybe this will prevent DTs from messing up holds and giving us a terrible reputation.
Recovery of Save 4 Less’s Post on Feb 25, 2017 at 10:34 AM
Last updated Feb 25, 2017 at 10:34 AM
What I noticed:
- I personally think Ancient Memory is an all or nothing skill. You either max it or you don't since it really doesn't scale well enough to only warrant just one or a few points into it, you'd probably get more out of dumping the SP into other skills than the tiny amount of temporary INT you'd get from only a few ranks of AM.
- I think you should also mention Composure. It's a common Female Slayer passive which people tend to forget about (I'd say 90% of Female Slayer players probably aren't even aware of it). It gives you up to 5% Physical and Magical Crit Rate based on your combo, its very easy to stack on DT so its basically a free 5% Crit Rate buff.
- I think you should mention what stats Dark Templar Plate Armor Mastery gives since alot of people just don't read the skill and think that Plate Armor is absolutely necessary.
- Saying DT is entirely shadow locked is wrong, there are some skills that can actually apply non-shadow damage. Hidden Blade, Liberate - Madness, Deadly Cape, Destroyer, Doomsday, Immolation, and Judgement can all apply non-shadow damage. Of course its still not worth stacking non-shadow damage but this is important to know for something like Reshpon or even some ToDes floors.
- Yellow Dragon Motif Bracelet should be mentioned as a viable choice for Anton since most Anton monsters are Human Type.
- Mechanical Dragon Essence is a decent Magic Stone until you can afford a Shadow Damage tear, especially since you can get it for "free" like Becky's Special Goggles. There's also Volcanic Rock as a +16 Shadow Damage stone, if you're really lazy and don't feel like farming for Mechanical Dragon Essence but sometimes the proc from Volcanic Rock can actually be a hindrance.
- I think you should explain why Purifion Sword is bad instead of just saying "its bad and you should feel bad". I thought it was an okay weapon since it has an abnormally high M. Att (Purifion has 1360 M. att, while level 85 Epic SS have 1214 M. att and Dark Star has 1280 M. Att) and the other effects are okay as well. It's obviously not a top tier weapon and I personally wouldn't spend gold getting one, but I don't think it's "you shouldn't even bother using it" tier like most other leg ss/katana for DT typically are.
- Why bother mentioning Quadro Cassiterum Coil if you don't recommend it? May as well just omit this. If you really need a purchasable legendary belt to recommend then I think Clown's Sorrow might be a better suggestion.
- World Pendulum should definitely be mentioned as a viable Epic Weapon choice since it has +40 shadow damage, +18% highest elemental bonus damage (It's basically shadow elenore) and +1 to level 75-85 skills. It's basically a better version of Mysteltainn.
You need to mention that the cap in both Normal Anton and Anton Raid is 15 seconds and that there is a visual warning as you're approaching it (3 colored shell warnings of white, yellow, red and then the shell shattering when it the cap is reached). I took a picture a long time ago of the visual warnings that you're free to use:
- It's Light-Naught, not Light Nut. They fixed the name of the set a long time ago.
- It's Absorbent Egene not Eugene. It's not a typo like most people think, his name is literally Egene
Recovery of Pyros’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 1:14 PM
Oh the berserk antihold is a whole 15secs on everything? Didn't know it was a flat value, or that it was that much. That's like, a fucking eternity unless your grp isn't geared properly.
On the holding berserk mechanic, does it reset instantly if you stop holding or does it go down over time instead?
Recovery of Holypie’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 2:08 PM
In anton it drops instantly, in Luke I think it drops over time.
Recovery of PeachShade’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 3:15 PM
Ah thanks. As for Purifion sword, I didn't notice it had abnormally high magic attack, not sure if that will make a difference for how good it is. I mentioned Quadrao Cassiterum because it has 2 6% effects and I'm worried people with low crit will look at it and think "12% damage!". I'll include dragon bracelet, forgot about that, Forgot World Pendulum too (not sure how since I'm looking for it). I do need to add in a section for Composure, thank you for reminding me of it.
As for the shadow locked, I think I'll put that in the tips section, because I put DT as shadow locked mainly since I don't want people gearing any more caravella DT's on me. I should probably explain it for Reshipon though. Thanks!
Also can't believe I forgot to put his color barrier thing for hold cap, thank you!
Recovery of Mojo_Rhino’s Post on Feb 24, 2017 at 8:20 PM
Last updated Feb 24, 2017 at 8:20 PM
Pyros I agree with above. Learn the holds and you could raid nakid fine if you have an epic DPS in your group. Even better if it's with friends you can communicate with. The 6-3 chron set with a mind stim pot is a good place to start. As you start getting epics it's easy to use that set to fill around them too.
Tbh honest im trying to help get my static ready for zerging legs every week. If I could have a gearless DT in every group that knew the holds I'm confident every boss in legs would be 1 cycled. Shadow binding is soooo broke in phase 1 anton/BV.
Edit: wait whose reset raids you do? I bring a guy to chalks every week. If you want boss/general flow related tips I'm happy to offer suggestions.
Recovery of Pyros’s Post on Feb 25, 2017 at 9:38 AM
Well I did reset raids but probably won't for a while until I'm awake at that time again. I generally do my sader and my fmech, all my chars have Pyros in the name, I do chalk raid pretty often(in the past few weeks at least), did his 3rd raid on my sader today but that was like 2hours after reset or something. I was just curious about DT gear reqs, I assumed I could raid with nothing but was wondering if people had different expectations now that a lot of ppl are better geared than they used to. I'll probably try to apply to a few random pubs and see how it goes, after I'm done with my other stuff.
Recovery of PeachShade’s Post on Feb 25, 2017 at 4:43 PM
Applying to pubs and applying to statics with DT will be a LOT different. I once had a static where a DT was in magic seals, random force chron pieces, and I think a halidom weapon. They knew how to hold. With pubs, they don't know if you can hold or not, and will have actual equipment expectations. Depending on the raid leader, and what they need, they'll take you in CK gear, but if you want to reliably get into raid and look like a strong/geared DT, you're gonna want 6pc Vilmark. The super armor is really nice, and it also shows that you've actually put some effort into the class, so you more likely know how to hold (Though I have seen many a geared DT prove me wrong).
Recovery of Pyros’s Post on Feb 25, 2017 at 4:58 PM
I got accepted in a raid with 6pc CK and some random stuff. Turns out holding with some lag isn't quite as easy as it is when I'm soloing though, and shit moving the mobs doesn't help, so it was quite a mess, in large part because of me(our DPS wasn't very geared so I had to hold properly for it to be smooth and I fucked up a bunch). Still cleared easily though cause 90 cap and all. I'll be getting a few more pieces of vilmark set probably later on. Only have this and my skirm to gear with Gracia and skirm I'm not gonna be raiding on anyway so it can wait.
Recovery of RubberDuckie’s Post on Mar 3, 2017 at 8:53 AM
I am having Trimble accessing the guide. Can anyone else load it?
Recovery of PeachShade’s Post on May 30, 2017 at 7:20 PM
As of today parts of this guide such as the TP points, some skill descriptions, as well as various other tid bits are out of date due to Infinity patch. I will post another update once I have updated he guide for this patch and added in things such as congest swaps.