Does Tog Actually Have Zero Defense?

Discussion in 'Guides & Game Mechanics' started by Necrofancy, Nov 15, 2016.

  1. Necrofancy Blame Blobâ„¢

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    So, I've been meaning to test how defense shred on Tog works, and in general find out how damage on him exactly works. It'd also help me understand Abnormal Status Damage, because he completely wrecks my model of how it works.

    Thanks to the updates for percent defense shred, it's now pretty easy to set up and test against him. The most interesting thing is; I expected defense shreds to increase damage by either a fair bit, or nearly zero because of defense shred caps. However, I quickly found that it wasn't just nearly zero, it was precisely zero.

    That, combined with some other tests, leaves me to believe that Tog actually has zero base defense, but 99.5% reinforce-like reductions for both Physical or Magical damage.
    How Does Reduction Get Calculated?
    For both players attacking monsters, and monsters hitting players with direct damage attacks, here's how damage reduction is applied.
    • First, defense and defense modifiers are applied:
      • Flat modifiers are applied first (either buffing or debuffing)
      • Percent Modifiers are applied next (again, either buffing or debuffing)
    • Reduction is then calculated, and then any reduction modifiers are also applied.
      • These factors are the target defense, and the attackers level.
        • R = D / (D+200L)
          • R: Reduction
          • D: Monster/Target Defense
          • L: Player/Attacker Level
      • After R is calculated, additional reduction modifiers are then applied.
    From the player side, it's easy to confirm this on Necromancer:
    • Flat defense bonus from Obedient Ghost in Protection Stance is applied
    • Percent defense bonus from Vallacre the Slaughterer is applied
    • Reduction modifiers from Skin Avatar and Reinforcement/Amplification are then applied.
    Considering how big all these buffs are, it's actually really easy for Necromancers to hit the stats screen def cap (hitting 100%+ reduction)
    [​IMG]

    Bremen Defense Shred Testing:
    Training Room:

    As said before, not just "nearly zero" improvement; precisely zero damage improvement.


    What if Training Room doesn't affect it? Let's do the same thing in Normals:
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Piercing Damage Testing:
    There are mobs that have an indeterminate amount of defense, but have a 100% reduction modifier to all damage (e.g. Metal Slimes or some enemies encountered while leveling up) - these are the ones you deal 1 damage to with all direct hits. Let's rule that out with a quick test; do a large-percent skill in Training Room.
    [​IMG]
    Obviously, piercing damage affects Tog, so it's not a damage modifier applied afterwards. Side note - piercing damage has no variance at all - I consistently got 827,222 damage.

    So, piercing damage ignores situations where base damage would get zero'd out. This makes perfect sense to me for a lot of reasons:
    • When Dark Ritual allowed me to reduce my STR well below -250, I could still do physical damage based on my piercing damage to enemies (not objects, funny enough).
    • Having over 100% reductions does not make you completely invincible to direct damage - APCs and other enemies can definitely have some amount of piercing attack as well.
    Reduction Testing Through Changing Levels:

    My weapon is neutral element (otherwise Tog would take 1 damage), I have no reinforcement (who would do this on creator) and my clicks do 1/200th the damage on Tog as they do on reinforcement machine which is consistent with a 99.5% reduction.

    If Tog had 3,422,800 DEF exactly, then I would actually expect a 99.62% reduction; I should actually be doing 144 per click if that was the case and I was hitting 37400 damage clicks on Tog.


    So, that's the best I can test with direct damage. However, I have another trick up my sleeve; I can test abnormal status damage using Razor Queen's Necklace!
    Do Defense Modifiers Affect Abnormal Status Damage?

    Between the initial application and re-application, I summon Nicholas in defensive stance to adjust base defense. This reduces the damage on the re-application.

    Do Reduction Modifiers Affect Abnormal Status Damage?

    Between the initial application and re-application, I change physical reduction by re-equipping my Skin Avatar. This has no effect on the abnormal status damage I'm taking! (I'm also chilling with Vallacre and Nicholas up to take even less damage than in the previous animation).

    So What Does This Mean?
    Based on this, and other factors with Tog, I can almost guarantee that Tog has no actual defense, but a reduction modifier.

    The explaining power of this:
    • This explains why Abnormal Status damage on Tog is 200x more potent, relatively speaking, than direct damage, whereas if he had actual defense he would only take about twice as much damage from Abnormal Status damage. From my previous testing, abnormal status damage has been reduced by monster defense, but seemingly using half the defense to calculate reductions.
    • Explains why Tog damage does not improve at all (precisely zero improvement) better than defense shred caps.
    • Also explains why piercing damage is still very effective on Tog.
    Aside from that? Explains why you should get Blade Soul/Kalla set on SB (until that gets killed) - no other set is remotely useful aside from your damage set aside from that.
     
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  2. boosted180sx Young blood

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    that's actually interesting. Tog's def mechanics could have possibly been changed when raid hp revamp happened.

    tog def was initially 3.6m def when it first came out(dfog never got this tog). After the first initial revamp where togs tornado was changed to two nados instead of one following a player it became 3.4m. So they might have possibly changed tog again.
    [​IMG]
     
  3. SkyArt

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    Was that released by Neople or made by someone?
     
  4. Eurasia

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    This might've been changed again in the most recent patch. Did a simple test and it looks like there is some def on tog.

    Naked character.
    [​IMG]
    With Lucky Feeling procced (note the lollipop floating near my IGN, and the blue aura on tog)
    [​IMG]
    Lucky feeling tooltip:
    [​IMG]

    EDIT: After doing a different set of tests, it does seem like tog has 0 def and 99.5% damage reduction. His abnormal status reduction is however, not 0. From my measurement, it's 84010.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2016

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