D-Day: DFOG Female Spitfire Primer

Discussion in 'Spitfire' started by nihil679, Sep 6, 2016.

  1. nihil679

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    Guide

    Alternatively published version for better(?) viewing

    Wanted to put out a more updated guide that also touches on gearing so there would (hopefully) be less questions about "is this random epic worth using?"
    Tell me if there's any issues with it, other than the fact it's bland and lacks pictures and is on Google Docs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2016
  2. Hervey Administrator

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    • “Air teching” requires 2 Nitro charges only if you were airborne to begin with.
      • You cannot air tech if you were launched from the ground.
    Won't let me change the formatting on that but anyways, I've noticed sometimes even if I'm midair I still can't do it if I get hit. I still don't fully get the restrictions.
     
  3. nihil679

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    It's finnicky, but it's been working for me (whenever I notice I'm actually knocked out of the air anyways).
    You need to be airborne with 2 Nitro charges. If you get swatted out of the air, you should be able to air tech, consuming 2 Nitro charges. Using the 1 Nitro charge from Quartermaster is no good either.
    The only one I've been doing it with 100% consistency is the guild dungeon archer Rising Shot, which I usually press spacebar to quickfall. I recall C to airtech working for me as well, mainly getting swatted by the trashmobs in Anton.

    I'll try checking it a bit more some other time if there's some other weird restriction I never noticed.
     
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  4. Hervey Administrator

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    Maybe it's just because I don't have enough charges and just didn't notice.

    Anyways as to actual things in the guide, imo I consider Servo Nitro a must max. You can't have Quarter Master up all the time, and being up to do two full rotation of nades in one jump is really helpful. Most kdnf spits I've seen have it.
    I'd change the wording on cspd on QM to say that it does affect it, just we don't know to the exact extent I suppose. I do agree though that up to ~40% is when you feel the biggest difference, and I'd venture to say if you don't have an Arithmetic that you should have at least one cspd avatar.
     
  5. nihil679

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    It's helpful, but unlike Aerial Fire for bullet build, it's not vital. For grenades, it simply helps dispense grenades faster and it doesn't substitute as a Quartermaster downtime filler because if you used Quartermaster, you already exhausted your primary damage, in this case grenades. From Quartermaster, land, throw remaining grenades, wait for reload, reload, then throw grenades until closer to 1 count for efficiency, you most likely will have Quartermaster back up in time.
    I also don't think there are a lot of situations where the extra round of grenades will actually allow you to DPS that much better. I'd argue that Aerial Fire in a grenade build at least allows better DPS during grenade loading downtime.
    This is why I've pushed it to a preference choice. However, I will note grenades will prefer Servo Nitro as a convenience, I still don't think it's quite as vital.

    Changed Quartermaster. Wanted to err on the safe side, but I suppose it sounded too hypothetical the way I had it.
     
  6. Ashye

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    I have both. FSpit has so many extra SP that I don't really see a reason to not get both.

    Nitro is good for mobility, and does actually increase your DPS marginally. Useful in Anton Normal for stuff like Lava Worm (quickly fly over to the turtle and still have charges to bomb it) or for bosses where you don't want to burn Quartermaster (Atol and Agnes Clones usually).

    Aerial Fire is good for Egene in order to get tons of Blazing Bullet shots out. The damage from bullets is pretty garbage.
     
  7. nihil679

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    I'll relent.
    Maybe I'm just spoiled, it's always been Quartermaster or nothing for me, I found the situations where I actually wanted to use Servo Nitro to be little.
     
  8. Hervey Administrator

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    I use Nitro literally all the time, honestly.
    And yeah that Lava Worm is a great example Ashye, I can fly over and kill the turtle without ever landing.

    In Smoke it's good for killing Tog, you can get more nades off without having to jump up and down.
    Not much use in Battleground, you should have time to QM for both most likely and they both just fall over.
    In Leg I use Nitro in room 2 and QM room 4, comes up right as we get to Agnes.
    In Energy I use Nitro in the room before Ator, and use QM on Ator. Then I use Nitro again for Lava Worm.
    In Volcano I Nitro Kres and use QM on Magtonium Five usually. If not him, Medel.

    I tested it in dojo, I can unload all my nades in around 18s during the duration of Nitro, it takes me almost a full 30s to do so without. Obviously mileage may vary a bit on that but it's clearly a DPS boost during non-QM.
    Even then, I see kdnf fspits do Nitro > use 6 charges > QM.

    And every single kdnf fspit raid video I've seen uses it.

    All that being said, I disagree with it not being vital. I think it's core.
     
  9. nihil679

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    :surrender:
    [​IMG]
     
  10. Basedx

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    So a question here regarding gearing and Anton Normal/Raid.
    Prefacing with my current gear:
    6Pc Primitive Strike (Head/Top/Shoes/Bracelet/Necklace/Ring)
    Sea God's Pants
    Tactical Lord Belt
    The King's Book of Secrets - Valkyrie
    Ratria's Tear
    4/6 Halidom Bowgun
    Petit Freyja Pet

    Plans are get Lib/Requiem Bowgun asap, and Great Glory Bracelet. Swap out Great Glory for another Chron piece in Anton for the Tactical Lord Belt for effect and to retain 6pc Primitive.

    From what i understand is 6pc Primitive Strike is a must in any build thats not bullet. I was told do Normals to get Gigantic Presence, and swap out gear to retain 6pc Primitive Strike and Sea God's Pants after i get the set. How correct is this? Am i normal ready? And is Raid gear just 6pc Primitive Strike + epic weapon like this says? Im not going to lie gearing in DFO seems hard to figure out.
     
  11. nihil679

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    No one uses Gigantic Pressure with Primitive Strike, I don't know where people are spreading that idea, this is like my third time seeing it.
    In most cases, you're wasting your time and resources if you get Gigantic Pressure as an FSpit. I've rarely seen it used even for off-chronicle builds for FSpitfire. Maybe it can be argued for a really weird full epic set-up that already has smash and critmod but still favors grenades in some way (RoT/new lv90 epic or legendary or Salvation weapon or something outstanding).
    Do Normals for the nice enchants, Gigantic Pressure will mostly be a waste.

    Standard set-up should be fine for Anton Normals. Raid gear I can't tell you until I actually do it myself, but that set-up was one of the most used set-ups for FSpitfires in DNF as far as I can tell, and Yunha in the Minimum Gear thread has stated that is so before.

    I don't remember what belt did exactly, but swapping out smash/critmod for the aura option is most likely detrimental to your personal DPS.
     
  12. Basedx

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    Thanks for the info. Problem with gearing in DFO is the lack of direct info sources or proper guides. So forget gigantic basically, got it. Do you think the aura would benefit the parties DPS enough that it is a better option? Or would that really depend on party composition? I guess as of right now i'll stick with the original build i was going for. After i get the Glory bracelet is there really anything to get outside of epics? Even then i mostly only see epic weapons advocated and not any gear.
     
  13. Hervey Administrator

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    That's because you don't really have a choice in what epics drop, you just use what you have. Got a smash mod epic to drop? Well, time to ditch that Great Glory Bracelet and find another source of crit smash. That kind of thing. Weapons are a little more linear than that. If you get Rule of Thumb, you use it over Liberation, no questions asked.
    If you get [insert smash epic] you can't really say the same thing, since it depends on your setup.

    Or more simply put, you can't put a tier on a lot of individual epics, because it's all situational.

    You can simply say Lord of Ranger >= Rule of Thumb > Liberation for a grenade build and that's always the truth.
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2016
  14. Tienhuli Tendency for wall of text

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    Hmm... how's icespark then? I have a 8 refine icespark on my f spit but I keep reading that icespark is primarily for bullet builds. I can't really afford spamming hell that much on my f spit, but considering how easy it is for f spit to induce burn on a target, wouldn't icespark still be really strong for a grenade build considering all the delicious elenore? My current setup is prim strike 6 piece, sea god trousers, great glory bracelet, lv 85 rainbow stone and frozen insignia. I wasn't sure whether to switch frozen insignia for hyper tau arithmetic unit because my crit's already above 80% and for king's book of secrets I'm not sure whether there's point getting another +1 grenade mastery as with TOA title my double throw chance is already 100%. I also consider switching frozen insignia for origin of nature for the +18 in all elem dmg compared to frozen insignias +27 water dmg.
    Still wondering about bullet build though, because I really feel as if bullets are... kind of garbage? Most of the f spits I see that run bullet builds kind of run full epic with either icespark, ranger rod or salvation autogun.
     
  15. nihil679

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    Ice Spark no longer has elenore based on burn/freeze - it's now a flat elenore for all intents and purposes.
    Ice Spark's main fault is that you lose the synergy between FSpitfire and Soul Bender, which tends to offer a lot of damage through Saya Necromancy. Needless to say, you also lose the freeze utility that FSpitfire should offer.
    Bullet build, from what I now understand, seems like just a consequence of Ice Spark. In any other case, there's not a lot of reason to not use grenades because grenades are just so much more versatile and easier.

    If you have level 15 Grenade Mastery already, you don't need another +1, and if you already hit crit cap, you don't need Arithmetic.
     
  16. Tienhuli Tendency for wall of text

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    With the remark to freeze utility, I can still freeze enemies fairly easily with ice bullets and ice nades though, my icespark doesn't prevent that as far as I see. If there's really flat 15% fire elenore, it should in theory defreeze the enemy every attack no? Yet that doesn't seem to be the case here.
    Edit: I'm aware activating the active on icespark would nullify freezes due to the burn inflict, but I just don't activate it because I don't think the status effect is... worth losing the freeze utility?
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2016
  17. nihil679

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    You're understanding it quite wrong on multiple levels.

    First off, ignore whatever the tooltips for Ice Spark Bowgun say. Pay close attention, here's what Ice Spark Bowgun actually gives you:
    Inflict fire damage.
    Inflict water damage.
    +15% additional damage (elenore).
    +15% additional damage (elenore).
    Chance to burn/freeze when attacking on activation.

    The proc is useless unless you're using the Filir accessory or whichever one that requires burn for additional damage. For the purpose of explanation, ignore that this exists. It has no bearings on this explanation whatsoever.

    It's not "fire elenore," it's inflict fire. The elenore has absolutely nothing to do with this. The problem here is COMPLETELY inflict fire.

    Inflict element works in DFO where if you have multiple elements stacked, for the purpose of "inflicting" it, ALL ELEMENTS are applied, even though damage calculation will only calculate one elemental damage (the elemental damage stat that will do the most damage). If you put on all 4 element flasks, all 4 element effects will show.

    The reason Ice Spark does not synergize with freeze is not because it prevents freeze, but because any follow-up attack on a frozen enemy will instantly melt freeze. Freezing Bullet or hitting with the actual body of Freeze Grenade will still unfreeze enemies, because neither of these are pure elemental, they are neutral with element applied*.
    Simply freezing an enemy isn't good enough, you need to be hitting them while they are frozen for Soul Bender's Saya Necromancy. If you hit the enemy with Buster Grenade, or the body of any grenade, it will unfreeze the enemy. You are losing valuable damage compared to any weapon that does not have inflict fire.

    * When shooting bullets, there are always 2 components: The normal bullet (as if shooting raw), and the enchant. The normal bullet is neutral with inflict element applied based on your enchant. The enchant is pure element.
    When throwing grenades, grenades also have 2 components: The grenade body and the explosion. While the grenade body does absolutely no damage, it inflicts collision on an enemy to trigger the explosion - THIS INFLICTS ELEMENT. The explosion however, is pure element.
     
  18. Tienhuli Tendency for wall of text

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    So essentially it's not that the enemies don't melt, it's more that they melt and then gets refrozen in the same attack? Otherwise I can't really find an explanation why my enemies never seem to melt.
     
  19. nihil679

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    Yes, that's what's happening.
    The problem is while you think the small window of being unfrozen is not a big deal, your next attack does not get Saya Necromancy boosted - therefore you are losing damage.
    It also only takes such a small window for end-game bosses to free themselves from holds - this has the potential to be very, very bad.
     
  20. Safice

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    Hey, I read the guide, and saw that spits can really do any elemental build after the update, I was planning to go for Gracia but remembered I have some various epics, namely 3 pieces of Dark Gothic (shoulder, top and shoes), a Darkness Low Sash, and a Superstar Ring. With all of this equipped I reach 149 Shadow damage with the -44 aura (not including elemental damage rolls on accessories), would this be worth using over Gracia?

    Maybe switch out the Superstar piece for Gigantic Presence, and grab the typical DG Sub Equip/Magic Stone?

    I figure I don't need Great Glory because I have a Code Number 608 so it would cover that base...
    If this setting can work, what do you think I should do for the pants, should I keep my Sea God pants or try to find something else to wear there?

    (sorry if the colors and bolds are a bother, just trying to highlight key words :p)
     

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